The House Judiciary Committee on Wednesday released the transcript and video of its deposition with former special counsel Jack Smith, who led two failed prosecutions of President Donald Trump.
The closed-door deposition took place on Dec. 17 in Washington, D.C. Smith was appointed to his former role in 2022 by then-Attorney General Merrick Garland and resigned earlier this year, less than two weeks before Trump resumed office and just after Smith completed a report that found that the department had enough evidence to convict Trump of election interference by working to overthrow his 2020 election loss to former president Joe Biden.
The day after Smith completed the deposition, his lawyers wrote a letter to House Judiciary Committee Chairman Rep. Jim Jordan, R-Ohio, asking him to release the full video of the deposition quickly, writing, “Doing so will ensure that the American people can hear the facts directly from Mr. Smith, rather than through second-hand accounts.”
In the more than 250-page transcript, released on New Year’s Eve, Smith discusses the two criminal investigations of Trump that he led: one that alleged Trump had interfered in the 2020 presidential election by spreading false claims of widespread voter fraud and organizing fake slates of electors to subvert the results, and one alleging Trump improperly stored classified documents at his Mar-a-Lago estate in Florida after his first term in office.
In the deposition, Smith called the Jan. 6, 2021 Capitol riot — when a huge mob of Trump supporters invaded the U.S. Capitol, attacking police officers — “an attack on the structure of our democracy in which over 140 heroic law enforcement officers were assaulted.” He added that Trump “was by a large measure the most culpable and most responsible person in this conspiracy.” The attack led to several deaths.
Smith rejected the allegations — which have come from Trump and other Republicans — that he had political motivations in pursuing the election interference case against Trump. The president has called Smith “a thug,” “a failed prosecutor,” and “a bad man, an evil man.”
“These crimes were committed for his benefit,” Smith said of Trump and Jan. 6. “The attack that happened at the Capitol, part of this case, does not happen without him. The other co-conspirators were doing this for his benefit. So in terms of why we would pursue a case against him, I entirely disagree with any characterization that our work was in any way meant to hamper him in the Presidential election.”
Smith said that there was “absolutely” a time he thought he might not bring an indictment, and added that he would have been “comfortable” with that outcome if the facts and the law didn’t add up.
Smith also said that the strength of the election interference case came, in part, from the fact that Trump’s own allies were prepared to testify against him.
“We had an elector in Pennsylvania who is a former Congressman
who was going to be an elector for President Trump who said that what they were trying to do was an attempt to overthrow the government and illegal,” Smith said. “Our case was built on, frankly, Republicans who put their allegiance to the country before the party.”
Another ally was more high-profile: Trump’s then-lawyer Rudy Giuliani, who Smith said participated in a recorded interview during which “he disavowed a number of the [voter-fraud] claims.” One of them was Ruby Freeman, one of two Georgia election workers to whom Giuliani was ordered to pay nearly $150 million after spreading lies about their roles in the 2020 election.
“He claimed they were mistakes or hyperbole, even the claim about Ruby Freeman, where he, you know, basically destroyed this poor woman’s life by claiming she was a vote scammer,” Smith said.
Smith insisted Attorney General Merrick Garland never pressured him to be more “aggressive” in his investigation of Trump, and that neither President Biden nor other White House officials told him they expected him to bring charges against Trump. He also said he would have accepted the role of special counsel to investigate either Biden or former president Barack Obama. And he said he does not believe the Supreme Court’s ruling on executive immunity “constitutes an exoneration” of Trump in the weeks and months leading up to and on Jan. 6. Under Smith’s direction, Trump was indicted on four felony counts — including conspiracy to defraud the United States and conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding — related to the election interference case on Aug. 1, 2023. That case was scheduled to go to trial, but Trump’s defense succeeded at delaying the start until after the 2024 presidential election. The case was ultimately dismissed by the Department of Justice after Trump won his second term, due to a long-standing DOJ policy that prevents sitting presidents from facing criminal prosecution. The classified documents case was dismissed last year by U.S. District Judge Aileen Cannon of the Southern District of Florida, a Trump-appointee. Smith appealed Cannon’s dismissal but dropped the effort after Trump’s 2024 election win, effectively putting the criminal case to rest. Smith also said he expected further attacks from the president, and that he would not be surprised if the DOJ indicts him. “I am eyes wide open that this President will seek retribution against me if he can,” Smith said. “I know that.” Read the full transcript of the deposition below. Sydney Carruth and Kevin Frey contributed reporting.
Julianne McShane is a breaking news reporter for MS NOW. Recommended
